10 months in and counting

[english_cousin]

Hi

I've been an avid reader of this forum for the last 7 months or so but havent really posted much myself as never really had anything to add. Very useful though so thanks to everyone, especially the experienced ones out there. I've now been experiencing this fun condition for about 10 months now so thought id get typing.

I guess I'm better than when I first got hit, not having to take any pain killers and can walk a few miles each day without any increase in pain. I gave up on the medical route after the usual weeks of anti-biotics and ultrasound scan and have read HITP. I have visited Bill Taylor up in Scotland for trigger point work, went approx 6 times, which seemed to help. However expense/work got in the way and I havent been for about 3 months. I am now experiencing pain in the perineum for the first time, which, although its a nice change from the initial testicle pain, still not pleasent. I'm going to carry on doing the stretches and external trigger point work as the HITP outlines and in the New Year will probably start to see another PT I've found located nearer to me in the UK midlands. Hopefully this will get me over this hump.

I guess I just wanted to write that I'm finding this a really frustrating condition. Definitly in the 2 step forward 1 step back part at the moment. I think I've got over one bit and then something else starts up. I havent yet been suffering from any other related conditions (IBS etc) so guess thankful for that. However I really do miss exercising, can't even go for a gentle jog so guess snowboarding is out for the moment....

Had 1 question for scotsman ref his visit to the wise clinic last week but wasn't sure how to post it onto his excellent thread as that seemed closed. Did you ever go and see Bill Taylor and if so how did the work Tim carried out differ from what Bill did?

Wishing all a happy Chrismas/New year and an improving 2010

nick

[graeme]

who is the pt in the midlands ,I'm a Brummie

[english_cousin]

Hi Graeme

I found this lot http://therapyfusion.com/home/. based in Stratford. I've spoken to Rachel Grubb and she has treated men with our condition and knew Bill from a course. I havent been to see her yet as was feeling better a couple of months ago but you know how it goes. Ill probably make an appointment with her in Jan. Ill let you know how it goes

nick
PS - I'm an Arsenal fan so lucky you asked for this before the match. might have sent you elsewhere on the 29th

[scotsman]

Had 1 question for scotsman ref his visit to the wise clinic last week but wasn't sure how to post it onto his excellent thread as that seemed closed. Did you ever go and see Bill Taylor and if so how did the work Tim carried out differ from what Bill did?

Hi Nick

I saw Bill for around 50 sessions. We made great progress in the early days, but my improvement then levelled off and we were only keeping it in check and I got the same value from doing self treatment.

With regards to the difference between Tim and Bill. Well, there's a question

A lot of their treatment was very similar - but I think Bill sufferers greatly from a very unstructured approach to treatment (he never seems to have a plan when treating me, never took notes, didn't record where my trouble spots were, etc). Bill also missed/didn't treat deep triggerpoints up past my prostate (levator ani) and he also didn't seem to really understand the true connection between the various external triggerpoints. He certainly found and treated the same external spots that Tim found, but he didn't seem to fully link how they all connected together. Lets not forgot that probably around 1% of Bill's work is chronic prostatitis / chronic pelvic pain syndrome related (or so I'd guess) but Tim has been specialising in this specific area for over 10 years and treats LOTS of chronic prostatitis / chronic pelvic pain syndrome patients every month.

So, in summary I'd say that Bill found around 80% of my triggerpoints, did treat some external ones but didn't approach the treatment in a structured fashion, missed some key internal spots, didn't place enough focus on the continued treatment of the external ones and didn't really seem to appreciate how important and tied in the treatment of the external triggerpoints were to specific internal trouble spots. He also didn't really give me any structured home stretching and external triggerpoint treatment regime.

Best analogy I can give is that seeing Bill was like being treated by a competent GP - but Tim is the Consultant you get referred too.

I don't regret seeing Bill - but I've had the main issue with my perinuem since the start and that was down to the deep internal triggerpoints (plus the connecting issues with the left thigh adductor and right sided abdominals) that seems to be the cause - and those are the points that Bill missed and Tim didn't.

The best in the business is Tim - if you can afford it get over there - if you can't afford it then Bill is certainly worth a visit, but you need to understand the limitations of his treatment. Bill needs to spend a couple weeks over with Tim plus get his act in gear on being more structured in his treatment approach. Doing those two things would take his treatment forward leaps and bounds.

One last point though is that Tim's whole approach now is to enable the patient to self-treat (after getting an assessment by Tim, some initial treatment, then given direction in internal/external triggerpoint work, skin rolling and the wand use) - so whilst the trip to see Tim may seem expensive, it's potentially a one off cost. I paid a lot seeing Bill over those 50 sessions (that was before he put his prices up for chronic prostatitis / chronic pelvic pain syndrome treatment).

With regards to personality - both were very similar - both very caring, comforting and compassionate.

Note that I've not seen Bill for over 4 years - so cannot comment on his current ability level.

Cheers
Richard.

Edited to say 'over 4 years' since seeing Bill - not three - where does the time go!

[english_cousin]

Thanks for the reply Richard, very useful. I agree with the lack of note taking by Bill but I did find him very helpful and certainly helped me over the 6 visits. Just a bit of a pain having to take the day off each time to get 45mins treatment. I think the 6 visits adds up to about £1200 so can see how it adds up. I'm seriously considering going over to Stanford but can't until at least April so might try a local women I've found before then. Going through a bad 'flare' at the moment so not happy....

The bit I would like to get most from Tim would be the self treatment. I'm a bit nervous about doing this myself without initial guidance but being able to manage this totally on your own would be a major plus.

Glad you made it home, seeing the weather we are having lately you did well to get back at all even with delays.

Have a great Xmas, dont let your boys wear you out too much.....

Nick

[scotsman]

Triggerpoint/physio work is only part of the solution - the relaxation element is equally as important. I can't recommend the clinic enough and if you're still suffering by the summer then get over there.

Have a great Xmas as well and here's to 2010 being a year of significant recovery for us all!

[graeme]

Did you mention Bill to any of the Stanford guys, Richard ? As I'm led to believe he has now been over himself for training

Arsenal fan ? Don't think we will catch you but 4th spot is ours to lose thanks to Liverpool

How long is your wand Richard and your right about Bill not taking notes etc seemed like you had to recap him each visit which was frustrating

[webslave]

Did you mention Bill to any of the Stanford guys, Richard ? As I'm led to believe he has now been over himself for training

Interesting. We need to know if this is true or not. Is Taylor now claiming to have been to Stanford? Let's get to the bottom of this one.

[scotsman]

Did you mention Bill to any of the Stanford guys, Richard ? As I'm led to believe he has now been over himself for training

Interesting. We need to know if this is true or not. Is Taylor now claiming to have been to Stanford? Let's get to the bottom of this one.

We need to clarify it with David Wise, but I did mention Bill on a number of occasions and it was never mentioned that he'd been over there. Tim's reaction to BIll being mentioned would lead me very strongly to believe that he hasn't been.

Graeme - did Bill specifically say he'd been over, or was that just the conclusion you reached yourself?

[english_cousin]

Chaps

I last saw Bill in Oct and he had never mentioned having gone over to the Stanford guys. He had been over to Dublin the year before for a course which I believe was run by a couple of PTs trained by Tim but think that was about the closest. I might be wrong of course, often am....

Either way I found Bill to be excellent and would see him again if a bit closer. Certainly would recommend him to other UK sufferers, although totally agree with Richards earlier comment about Tim being the top man.

Nick

[graeme]

So Bill has been trained by PTs who have been trained at Stanford. I knew he had received training which was linked to Stanford and I know he is putting a lot of time into chronic prostatitis / chronic pelvic pain syndrome at the moment, I am in touch with some of his patients who have been informing me of his work.

[flump]

I myself have seen Bill Taylor for almost a yr and I would not recommend him under ANY circumstances. I had never seen a pelvic floor PT until I saw Bill so I didn't know what was a right way to treat someone with this condition but after seeing Rhonda Katarinos in Chicago for over a yr and comparing the two the difference is NIGHT AND DAY!

I have irreversible damage to my sphincter caused by Bill Taylor, how did this happen? The man was putting 4 yes 4 fingers into my rectum and ramming them as fast as he could in and out of my rectum in his words "I am stripping the muscles". He was basically fist fucking me, absolute madness and pain like you would never believe! The man should be struck off he has no clue what he's doing and for that reason he should not be treating something he has no professional training in.

I am not the only one who has had damaged caused to them by Bill Taylor. He is a lawsuit waiting to happen

[webslave]

Flump, that is a very, very worrying post. I have never heard of anyone doing that before, and it has a suspiciously sexual aspect that sets off alarm bells for me.

Does anyone else feel this is disturbing?

[d_man]

uhm yes!

[Jay]

Wow. That is quite a story, and certainly runs contrary to everything I have learned about proper treatment of PFD. Sorry that you've had to deal with this, Flump, and I hope Rhonda is helping you.