Statistics

[kevin]

I was originally going to send this as a private message to winding_road, but I figure others might know something about it too.

I am very interested in doing a statistical analysis of my CPPS. I was wondering if you might know how I should go about this.

For the past ~6 months I have kept very detailed daily records of my symptoms in an Excel spreadsheet, with around 20 data points for each day. They include pain level, number of bathroom visits, stress level, physical activity, etc. I'm interested in finding out which of these symptoms correlate the most highly with one another. I don't know anything about statistics, though. I figure I could just make scattergrams for each combination of variables, but I'm sure the is a smarter way. Also, I don't know how to account for delayed reactions (heavy exercise might not affect my symptoms at all right away -- and thus show no correlation -- but it might have a high correlation with my pain level three days later). I have Stata, Matlab, Minitab, Mathematica, and Maple on my computer, too, so I could use those.

Does anyone know of somewhere I can start?

Thanks,

Kevin

[webslave]

For the past ~6 months I have kept very detailed daily records of my symptoms in an Excel spreadsheet, with around 20 data points for each day.

I don't wish to be rude, but have you had treatment for OCD?

[kevin]

Hi Webslave,

Do you seriously find this behavior exaggerated?

"Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder: A disorder in which individuals are plagued by persistent, recurring thoughts (obsessions) that reflect exaggerated anxiety or fears."

I've seen what were supposed to be the best years of my life go up in smoke, and have had to leave school because of my pain. Is an investment of one minute before I go to bed every night filling out one row of a spreadsheet exaggerated, in light of my (or anyone here's) condition? Especially when I'm doing it expressly for the purpose of collecting data? (Incidentally, another reason I'm doing this is that I don't have the time or energy to write up a journal entry each evening, which my doctors have advocated.)

These are not rhetorical questions or jabs at you, and I'm not angry. I'm seriously curious to find out whether you really mean that I'm taking this too seriously.

It was always my understanding that people go on elaborate multi-stage elimination diets, see multiple urologists or physical therapists, try herbal remedies etc, spend time on internet forums, and read studies not because they're obsessive or compulsive, but because the stakes are so high. I'd pay everything I'm worth to get my health back.

By the way, I pressed my doctor a while back to refer me to a psychiatrist, just to see if we could find any evidence of depression, OCD, or any other conditions known to be correlated with CPPS. The psychiatrist said there is no reason to suspect I have any mental disorder. He was surprised I wasn't more stressed out, given the situation.

[CppsDad]

I don't know anything about stats, but I'm a big supporter of patients keeping pain journals. I think it's a proactive way to manage pain, and for some people, may help them identify triggers like certain food or beverages. I kept a journal for a while during my initial PT treatments, and it was certainly interesting. I got too lazy to continue it, but others have mentioned self-created journals for pain on this board before. Anyway, I don't know much about stats. But I hope you find something in your data!

Michael

[BG0013]

OCD? This is something that ruins peoples lives, I think its ok to be obsessive with!!!

[BG0013]

Obsessed with getting better I should say, not obsessed in a way that makes you anxious and causes symptoms to be worsened.

[webslave]

No, I was just wondering out of curiosity, because a rather large % of CPPS-PM pts have anxiety-spectrum disorders, like OCD. If you were only filling out a spreadsheet once a day, it doesn't seem to obsessive ... I think I got the impression you were at it numerous times a day!

Not sure what value there is to it, unless you do it while undertaking treatment, so that you can chart improvements.

[kevin]

Haha, if I were doing it 20 times a day you probably would be justified in asking me if I have OCD

I'm constantly trying new treatments, and having nice clean charts has made it easier for me to notice works and what doesn't. While going through my chart, I recently found a strong relationship between how much I strain before urinating and how bad my urinary urgency gets. I stopped straining, and my urgency has dropped dramatically.

Kevin

[winding_road]

Good Perseverance Kevin
I know it's tough to do that. I keep statistics formyself too, but not as detailed as yours, this has helped me nail down my worse triggers.
Without noting down what I do, It would have taken me much longer to notice thos triggers. Having said that, when I orignally asked for people to
start a survey, it wasn t only for this.

About your question
Stata should be fine. The regressions you need to run are readily available. You can run regressions on lagged variables, (that is the value of some variable (for ex. # of Ejaculations ) 1 or/and 2 or and 3 days before ...). I have a paper to submit to a journal by middle of june, otherwise I could have done it for you. If you wait, I will be more than happy to help you .

[latte]

This is an interesting thread. Early on I went to a therapist and he kept saying, don't worry about it so much. Easy to say, hard to do. I have kept a diary for three years upon my wife's suggestion. The best part of it is reading back to when I was really in bad shape and compare to where I am now. It has helped a lot. Right now I am in a good place with little pain. Interestingly, the best advise I have had was from the first uro I visited. He said, you can't not feel the pain, just try to ignore it. The fact is, the less you think about it the better off you'll be in my opinion.

[SickofCP]

The fact is, the less you think about it the better off you'll be in my opinion.

When the mind/body deals with pain it tries to do one of two things:
1. Ignore it. Your mind runs away from aches and pains. But a pain so intimate and painful that comes with chronic prostatitis / chronic pelvic pain syndrome is difficult to ignore.
2. Guard against it. It's been well talked about, how we are guarding our genitals against the pain we feel, and this guarding is promoting more pain.

Paradoxical relaxation attempts to teach a different approach. You don't ignore the pain, you accept it. You have to learn to feel it and be passive with it.

To some degree you have to stop taking the temperature of your pain. For example, some months ago I realized that I had not felt the pain at the tip of my urethra for about a week. So all of that day I was checking in with myself to see if I could feel that sensation. I was trying to make sure that it really was not there. By the end of that day the pain at the end of the urethra was back and worse than it had been in a while.

You do have to check in with yourself when you do moment to moment relaxation throughout the day. This is to take some of the obvious pressure/tension/effort that you are putting on your pelvic muscles. I've posted before how I think many are trying to manoever their pelvic into a relaxed state by pushing, etc.

[darwin]

I'd be more interested in the following:
What percentage of those with chronic prostatitis / chronic pelvic pain syndrome also have:

1) IBS
2) pencil/pen chewing
3) Shy bladder syndrome
4) a first born child with in the past couple of years
5) have a sit down job
6) play/have played a lot of sports and which ones
7) have a high stress job
8) OCD
9) Anxiety/panic issues
10) Others?

Personally, I am yes on the first 6.

[blacklaw]

I'd be more interested in the following:
What percentage of those with chronic prostatitis / chronic pelvic pain syndrome also have:

1) IBS
2) pencil/pen chewing
3) Shy bladder syndrome
4) a first born child with in the past couple of years
5) have a sit down job
6) play/have played a lot of sports and which ones
7) have a high stress job
8) OCD
9) Anxiety/panic issues
10) Others?

Personally, I am yes on the first 6.

I am a yes to 3, 5, 6, 7, 9.

[DavidinLA]

I'd be more interested in the following:
What percentage of those with chronic prostatitis / chronic pelvic pain syndrome also have:

1) IBS
2) pencil/pen chewing
3) Shy bladder syndrome
4) a first born child with in the past couple of years
5) have a sit down job
6) play/have played a lot of sports and which ones
7) have a high stress job
8) OCD
9) Anxiety/panic issues
10) Others?

Personally, I am yes on the first 6.

For me, it's yes on 1, 3, 5, 7, & 9.

[Ginty]

I also score high on this list of characteristics - 3,5,7,9

I think 3 and 9 are the biggest factors/causes of my pelvic pain, and while I see anxiety being dicussed here often, it has surprised me how little shy bladder syndrome has been mentioned.......until now, 4 in a row!