Need Some Serious Help (GARYS case)

[GARYS]

Time for another question lol. I think some things are doing a little better which is good, I'm just wondering if burning kind of raw feeling inside the pelvic area is due to the muscles getting stretched or relaxing. I dont feel it when I'm stretching inside or outside more like in between treatments. Never had it before and just wondering.
Thanks

[webslave]

Could be. Sometimes treatment changes the nature of the pain, which is actually a good sign (means you're getting to the root of the problem).

[GARYS]

Thanks for the answers Webslave! I have been following the protocol daily with like I said some things feeling slightly better and other things a little worse. I was feeling a little rougher the other day and went to do my internal treatment and I'm not sure if it was just a coincidence or not but for the first time yet after using the wand I actually felt BETTER. it only lasted about ten hours but I couldn't wait until it was time for my next internal treatment to see if it would happen again. Unfortunately nothing changed. I'm just wondering from some of you that are doing the Wise-Anderson Protocol have had the same experience. I really wish I could do it again and notice a difference for the better again. I know its a tricky thing and Tim told me to slowly increase my pressure reading each week. Like I said just wanted to see if anyone had similar experiences.
Thanks

[yoink15]

GARYS,

Yes I can confirm at least for me that during my roughly two months now of following the Wise-Anderson Protocol very carefully, my symptoms of pain and frequency have changed. Where before my main complaint was frequency of urination, now my main complaint is pain. The frequency issue has become much less of a problem. I can go several hours without urinating. However now I have pain almost all the time...and that pain has shifted around in the last 8 weeks. It used to be sort of high up near my bladder, and then it became sort a burning in my prostate area, and then it shifted to the tip of the penis, and now I've got it on the right side of my pelvic area, like sort of between where the prostate is and where my leg connects to my hip, but inside. It's hard to describe. And the pain has changed gradually from achy to burning back to achy.

And sometimes I feel better during (or after) internal treatments and sometimes I don't. Sometimes it's for a few hours, sometimes it's the rest of the day...sometimes it's not until the NEXT day. I swear this condition is so mysterious sometimes. It's hard to tell if the pain is better or worse from day to day because it keeps changing all the time, at least for me.

[GARYS]

Yoink
Thats sounds exactly the same as me. Webslave says the pain changing or moving could be a good thing. I pray that it is!! I read on someones post that was doing the treatment he could deal with all of it if you could just know it was going to work. Aint that the truth. Putting in the time and effort into the treatment is hard especially when it takes so long to see improvement. I feel like I'm always doing some part of the treatment (my kids are always asking why I'm stretching again). Guess all we can do is keep on going. Its funny last night I was walking to where I stretch and accidently kicked a baby swing and it felt like it broke my toe (hurt pretty bad) and today its purple but when its pain you know is temporary its totaly different. Sad thing is I would be willing to stub my toe daily to trade the cpp. Stupid I know. I'm not backing off treatment and I just pray for the day I'm writting my success story!!!

[GARYS]

Figured I better jump off Kevkos thread. I saw another pt tonight because I can't help but feel I'm missing something. I had my hitp book with me and she went and grabbed hers. I thought great, finally a pt who might know what there doing, guess I'll see. She didn't work on me just checked me out but didn't really find anything big. She said I had very weak adductors and gave me a strengthening exercise to do but I don't think I'm going to do it. Also my hamstrings are really tight. So not what I was hoping for. Anyway wanted to get some input on this, I've been treating the sides of my prostate every other day for about nine weeks and while it seems the post urination burning is better at times but I have horrible frequency a lot more often now and the slightest pressure put on my bladder area makes my bladder feel way overly full. Anyone else get this or might be able to explain. I realize 9 to 10 weeks of working this area is a short period of time but its so frustrating having to pee all the time and wondering if I'm even doing the right things. I really need that feeling of improvement even temporarily just to know I'm doing the right thing. It did seem to happen once. I know the graph webslave posted on improvement showed different stages of improvement over many months but just seems I would feel some different even minor improvements. I mean I don't know that I'm getting those three steps forward two steps back. Think its just too soon? Sorry, not feeling too good this evening and needed to vent!!

[yoink15]

Hey GARYS,

Oh man I feel your pain. I know exactly what you're going through and it's miserable. When I have that horrible frequency it's like a slow motion nightmare that you can't wake up from. Everything you try to do is tainted by that horrible feeling and it's ABSOLUTELY AWFUL! Hang in there man! It will pass. Do you have access to any Benzodiazapene drugs like Klonopin or Valium? When I'm having nightmare frequency sometimes I take a quarter tab of Klonopin and go to sleep and I feel better the next day.
Sadly, I wish I could tell you that there's something that I do to make myself feel better beyond taking a benzo. I usually just have to ride it out. *SOMETIMES* doing the internal work helps. But you have to be really, really gentle. Doing the internal work too aggressively is WORSE than doing nothing at all...I'm living proof of that. I flared myself so hard that I wanted to die.

I've been treating the sides of my prostate for about the same amount of time that you have and I've noticed great improvement with pain relief but the frequency thing still plagues me. From what I understand the frequency in urination is the very, very last symptom to disappear. Maybe webslave or someone else can chime in with that experience. I thought I read somewhere that it's the last symptom to disappear.

Hey GARYS, did you know that Dr. Wise and Tim put out an excellent, amazing 39 page guide to using the wand and doing internal work? This guide did NOT exist when I went to the clinic in 2008. They just recently wrote it. I called Dr. Wise's office and they sent it to me. It's super helpful. Did you get it when you went to the clinic? (I have no idea how recently you went. Apparently they give it to all attendees now.) I'd be happy to email it to you if you give me your email addresss.

[webslave]

Gary, those IC symptoms you have may yield to instillations. Have you ever had one?

[yoink15]

God webslave, instillations sound AWFUL! It sounds like the cure is worse than the disease! Having to go twice a week for a year to have something pumped up your urethra sounds like it would GIVE you CPPS, not cure it. But then again, I guess if it helps...

[GARYS]

Thanks, sure it will pass, just want some evidence the treatment is working for me. As far as instillation goes that's not a place I ever want to go and pray I never need that done!!! I think I'll give Dr. Wise a call. Like the other guys food and drinks don't seem to have any effect on me. Yoink, do you ever get the kind of burning/pain in the urethra after urinating and that feeling like you even your waistband puts pressure on your bladder area? I don't remember the bladder type feelings before doing internal work. But if this area has been tight for 15 years maybe its just going to take longer to loosen. After looking at the diagram in A HEADACHE IN THE PELVIS maybe I've been applying too much pressure puborectalis (sides of prostate) since it can refer to bladder and urethra. Dr. Wise did tell me awhile back to ease up on the pressure but the book also says "firmly" when working this area. I've also been laying on a yoga ball to stretch my ab muscles. Maybe I'm trying too hard to get results. CONFUSING!!!!!

[yoink15]

Hey GARYS,
Man I *totally* get that burning/pain in the urethra sometimes after urinating and it's the absolute WORST. I got it two nights ago. For me, that specific symptom is so bad I call it "panic pain". It gives me pain that's so unique and bad that it makes me start to panic. It's so awful that I can't focus or concentrate on anything and I have to basically lay down and do a relaxation tape just to prevent me from going out of my mind. And yes, I also avoid tight jeans and belts now because I can't put tight pressure on my crotch or waist area. I only wear loose jeans and cargo pants now. The tighter the pants, the worse my symptoms become.

And ya I figured you might be going a little hard on the sides of your prostate. You said you were hitting the sides at 20 on the pressure gauge and for me that seems awfully high. I can barely go above 15 on the sides for me...and that's max. Dr. Wise's best advice to me on the phone (he said this to me three times) is to go SLOW SLOW SLOW. Be gentle. He said "make friends with those muscles down there. Go in there gently and press gently, and when you think you have a good pressure going....back it off and be even more gentle." When you press on those muscles on the sides of your prostate, you don't have to make yourself hurt! You need to be at a discomfort level of 3 on a personal pain scale of 1 to 10. At least, that's what the Wise-Anderson Protocol wand guide that I have says.

[GARYS]

Thanks Yoink
Sorry you have this too, but at least we know were not alone and the fact that you have seen some improvement helps my mental state. Starting with tomorrows treatment I'm backing off. Even though it really doesnt feel like I was pressing that hard, I guess I am too rough in there. Wanting results I even stretch legs and abs pretty rough, need to slow down there and maybe get more into the relaxation part!

[yoink15]

Hey GARYS,
Just checking in. How has backing off your pressure helped? I'm flaring right now (lol...the only time I come to the board now is when I'm flaring and in pain, but it gives me a chance to update everyone on how things have been going, both good and bad).
Over in another thread I read a technique that I think we.the.hulk mentioned and I think it's helping me. When I do my internal treatments, before I use the Wise-Anderson Protocol wand I start with my finger first, laying on my side, and I stretch out the anus along with any muscles I can reach all around the inside of the anus and that whole area (this is recommended in the Wise-Anderson Protocol wand guide that Dr. Wise sent me). When I get to the "front" part of my pelvis, I've changed techinques base on we.the.hulk's method. He recommends standing up in the bathroom, and lifting your right foot and putting it on the bathroom counter, and then reaching into your rectum from the front side with your finger. Then pull out and down. It works..I can get much deeper standing this way and I can stretch out the "front" pelvic muscles down and away from my prostate. It took me 4-6 days to figure out how to do this right, and I could go deeper and stretch more each time. Now I think I've got the hang of it and I (think) I'm feeling some results. But you know how this condition is. Feelings (both good and bad) wax and wane with startling randomness and sometimes it's impossible to tell if what you're doing is helping or hurting (at first).

Hang in their friend!

[GARYS]

Hi yoink, sorry about the flare, maybe your just hitting a good spot with that stretch!! I'm going to try it tonight (exciting evening plans). I tried to feel my prostate last treatment but I'm not sure if I did. The reason I tried was because I put some pressure on it with the wand because I feel like I have to be soo close doing my treatment. Anyway when I put some pressure on it I could get the pressure up around 15 so I'm still as confused as ever. I'll try putting a leg up and feel for it again. Scared I'm gonna hurt something pressing directly on the prostate? I've seen a pt four times now and we have been working the psoas which is really tight and painful so I've been reading a lot on that lately. If anyone can answer about the psoas causing some of my problem would great. Just still working for that connection of feeling better from treatment since I have always been so up and down, I never know. Take care and hopefully your flare is very short.

[GARYS]

Does anyone know if there is any direct connection between the levator ani and the psoas. I've tried looking it up but I'm not smart enough to understand what I've read. The reason I ask is that I've been using my wand for a couple months but in the past week I've been working a very tight painful psoas. I worked the psoas first today and then a few hours later the levator ani. The levator was a lot more tender this time (maybe a coincidence) but sometimes after working the psoas I feel like I have to work up the feeling to urinate which is opposite of my usual feeling. Just wondering
gotta be a connection, worked the psoas first tonight then internal, my numbers are way lower on the wand and hitting near the prostate is recreating my symptoms more than ever. soooo damn confusing!!!
Thanks