Bad experiences with Shrinks

Male pelvic pain, prostatitis, IC
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damien6
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Bad experiences with Shrinks

Post by damien6 »

Hello,

Look I'd like to make a point on a related topic that was raised on the News Research page. This post will come across as negative so I'm sorry about that.
The other irony is that the old school urologist who would refer "prostatodynia" patients on to a psychiatrist was probably doing the right thing after all!
We all recognise that this condition has a pschyological component and therefore a stress reduction should be a necessary part of the strategy. But the throwing of people to the pscyhologists can be just another way of putting people in the too hard basket to sit and stew. I was NOT diagnosed as suffering chronic prostatitis / chronic pelvic pain syndrome (or prostatitis as it is generally known in Oz), despite describing the symptoms in great detail and going to several GP's and the Sexual Health Clinic, nor was I sent to a Urologist. It was not until I developed an actual measurable infection that I was referred to a Urologist who then immediatly diagnosed CPPS/Prostatitis. Up to that point I'd been continually, faithfully, visiting shrinks, with obviously no result in the form of meaningful pain reduction or understanding of what was going on, which only resulted in a growing sense of upset and frustration. Shrinks didn't help because they didn't know what the underlying problem actually was and were more interested in talking about social factors, irelevancies, personal life style decisions and other factors which were none of their buisness nor related to the problem. What's that? Everything is part of their business or else you've got something to hide? Bulls**t! That gives them far more much power than they actually deserve and screwing around with everything in someones live, particularily when they're on the back foot, only leaves the patient feeling more demoralised.

Ah but here's the rub, even after I was correctly diagnosed the shrinks I went to, who were several, were still all uncomfortable talking about medical/sexual issues and so the time wasting continued. Ok so maybe I should have gone to a shrink who specialised wsith people with pyhsical problems, or my urologist or the GP's should have singled one out for me. That didn't occur because the general view was that one shrink was as good as any other. They "specialities" are all vauge anyway, personality this, consciousness that. You mention straightaway to the shrink the topic in hand and they all say they can help and they're fine with that, then it turns out its clearly not their speciality and you've just wasted your time. And because shrinks take forever THAT CAN BE YEARS AND YEARS of time!

I would probably never advise someone to go to a shrink who had a medical problem because it would just confirm the "its all in your head view ie so its nothing" which is worse than an insult, its criminally slack neglect. "There's nothing actually wrong with you" I heard that a lot from shrinks even after the diagnosis. They would use the uncertainty of the meidcal understanding as an excuse to dismiss its reality. How do they get away with it? Well because nobody questions the competence of shrinks, Oprah likes them and society thinks they're the bee's knees because "they care", so that's good enough. If you as the patient don't like your shrink that's because you have an antisocial disorder or are crazy in some other way. You can't argue as a patient because they the masters of dominating the interaction, ("who little me?") and waiting for the next one to be avaliable can take months and months will little hope they'll be much better.

SHRINKS ARE WORSE THAN CRAP because behind the well meaning fascade they are complety unaccountable, therefore any help they give is an optional extra and if they don't help, well so what. As for supply and demmand forget it, send everyone to a shrink and combine it with the fact that they drag things out forever and the waiting lists will always be huge. Oh and I understand shrinks often get depressed because they don't feel they do a very good job so they need lots and lots of vacation time to get over it, poor babies.

It was not until I received an actual diagnosis, I began to get real information about this disorder (largely from this website) and the hostile attitude from those around me began to recede that I began to actually move and improve on the stress and anxiety reduction front. I was not helped by years with shrinks. The improvement was initiated through real medical understanding which provided a foundation from which to understand the acute issues, ie pain, what caused it, why was it transitory, why did it respond to states of mind, why did it make everything so demoralising, why did it hurt just thinking about it or trying to address it. No pscyh will ever be able to help if the basics issues are incorrect or are generalised into meaninglessness.

Ok so shrinks should still work as an aid to the medical movement? In practise people will all too often be dumped there to rot because being sent to a shrink is a catch all for every problem and the patient is treated with hardly any respect or urgency. Any assistance must be provided by Dr/shrink not shrink/rubbish manager.

Do you guys even realise shrinks have potentially huge downsides? They "cure" you right up to the moment you commit suicide.

Damien

[I really don't care if I get kicked of the page for being disruptive those fu**ers have cost me years of grief]
Age:29 | Onset Age:24 Correct diagnosis Age: 27.5 | Symptoms: pain, burning in genital region | Helped By: Initial cystoscopy procedure which removed stricture and bladder carcinoma 30% better, less stress, getting better gradually | Worsened By: Feeling out of comfort zone/control, stress.
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bellowbellow
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Post by bellowbellow »

I can relate to what you're saying... when I was a teenager I was covered with psoriasis and, while my friends were out in the sun or getting laid, I was covered up, in pain and miserable.. the doctor at the clinic I was attending noticed how sad I was and sent me to a shrink... I told the shrink that is she could get rid of my psoriasis I'd be euphoric, however that didn't stop her from diagnosing me as depressed and putting me through a prolonged relatively useless process... a few years later when I found relief from my psoriasis, I did in fact become "happy" again...

Many years later, I encountered my second big health challenge, CP or, as I understand it now, CPPS... this time I sought out a shrink with a very clear agenda in my head (which I believe is very important)... I let him know all about my condition, the relentless pain and the many resulting issues relating to intimacy, despair etc... this time I had.. and am having... a good experience... I look at this therapy as part of my overall treatment plan... it may not be curing my chronic prostatitis / chronic pelvic pain syndrome but it is helping me cope with it... I'm also open to exploring what came first, my anxieties and my compulsions and my tendency toward depression or my physical ailments... I guess it's like searching for the chicken or egg answer....
44 years old. Chronic Prostatitis (onset age 38) for 6 years. In the midst of worst flare-up of my life. Tried all conventional methods without success. | Symptoms: Severe burning on tip of penis, burning between rectum and scrotum. Meds: Hytrin, Atavan, percocet (all at night). Natural Meds: Quercitin, Vitamin C and E and B Complex, Niacinimide, Salmon Oil, Garlic supplement, cranberry extract, concentrated liquid chlorophyll. | Helped By: warm baths, stretching, running. | Worsened By: not sure but suspect unhealthy eating, stress, negative thoughts.
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Post by carld »

Damien,

Sorry you have had negative experiences. It's not right that you should be left hanging when in need.

I would like to express the positive side of my experience with both a psychologist and psychiatrist. I credit these 2 individuals with working closely with me in understanding anxiety/panic disorders and health anxieties and other issues which have contributed to my onset of CP/CPPS. Through neurofeedback and many visits of positive feedback from both, I feel that I'm on the right path.

I wish I can say that for many people who have not shared the same positive experience as myself. I think having a strong mental understanding of this condition and how our thoughts effect our physical and our mental is an important part of stretched recovery as I will call it. It's not so black and white like many illnesses are. You continually recover over a long period of time, perhaps our whole lives. Once you understand that and accept that as part of your life, then I believe the real healing begins. It's not something a doctor of mental health or physical health can provide us with. It's with in your self.

So in the end, the old school uros were right after all to send us to mental health people. The tools are there, we just need to learn how to use them that's all.....


Regards, Carl...
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I encourage anxiety prone UCPPS people to consider L-Theanine
Age, 44 onset age 37 Feb 2006 Freq. need to urinate. Sensation of having to urinate soon after going. Perineum discomfort/burning/tightness, pubic area discomfort @ times,poor urine stream, post urine dripping/spray. All symptoms have improved with my protocol. At the worst I give it a 1 to 2 on irritation and discomfort and frequency. Helps: Elavil 5mg for anxiety and mast cell protection, (will only take it as needed) self internal PT as needed, stretching, walking, stairmaster cardio workout and light weights, reducing stress, moment to moment relaxation, deep breathing relaxation and using a Theracane. Makes worse: sitting for long periods, stress, over focusing on it. Currently 95%-98% recovered. Stay positive, relaxed and control your anxiety.
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Post by webslave »

carld wrote:So in the end, the old school uros were right after all to send us to mental health people.
I've often thought about the exquisite irony of that. They know instinctively that most of us are unusual mentally, I suppose, perhaps because we bug them far more than their other patients.
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damien6
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Post by damien6 »

Hey,

Thanks guys. Sorry I got a little steamed.

Damien
Age:29 | Onset Age:24 Correct diagnosis Age: 27.5 | Symptoms: pain, burning in genital region | Helped By: Initial cystoscopy procedure which removed stricture and bladder carcinoma 30% better, less stress, getting better gradually | Worsened By: Feeling out of comfort zone/control, stress.
latte
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Post by latte »

I went to a shrink several times and they were a bust. They tried to give me zoloft etc. and I couldn't take the side effects. They have become prescription writers and that's about it. They just give you one drug and if that doesn't work they try another. I had much better success with a psychologist that would actually listen to me and talk things through.
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Post by Howden »

I guess I have a good psychiatrist; maybe even an exceptional one. With his help I came to understand why I was a diehard perfectionist, how to let go a little bit, and overcame my OCD and depression. But I would not expect him to diagnose the cause of my pain. At the onset of my pain (I was seeing him about the OCD at the time) he told me I had to become an expert in my condition; he told me to read everything I could about it so that I knew more than the MD's. And he told me to search the net; which is how I found this site. That's just my experience though.
Age: 71; age at onset: 65; symptoms: initially rectal spasms; currently anal pain, pereneal pain, buttock pain; all pain on the right side; early diagnosis: chronic non bacterial prostatitis; treatments 4 long courses of antibiotics, accupuncture, naturopathy; current treatments: gabapentin, terasozin, Celeza, PT.
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Post by webslave »

latte wrote:I went to a shrink several times and they were a bust. They tried to give me zoloft etc. and I couldn't take the side effects. They have become prescription writers and that's about it. They just give you one drug and if that doesn't work they try another. I had much better success with a psychologist that would actually listen to me and talk things through.
The funny thing about SSRIs like Zoloft, Paxil, Celexa, Prozac, Lexapro etc is that they are all slightly different. I don't take them, but I have family members who do, plus a personal friend who is a psychiatrist, and I can assure you that if one does not work for you, you should try another, and so on, until you find one that you can tolerate. The newer SSRIs like Celexa and Lexapro tend to have fewer side effects.
Last edited by webslave on Tue Jun 05, 2007 12:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
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damien6
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Post by damien6 »

Whatever helps you I think. Internal things and feeling better about yourself definitely helps physically very substantially, I think we'd all agree to that and that plays a very important (perhaps crucial) part of the Stanford/Wise-Anderson Protocol. So whatever helps to that end. I wanted to post on this topic because there is often a "go to a shrink" attitude which people have to dismiss/answer someones problems and that doesn't always help and that the shrinks don't always help (psychiatrist or psychologist). Obviously I'm overgeneralising to make a point and I've found shrinks useful to me in many respects. However, friends and this message board have been far (far) more useful for me, I'm glad I'm not going to one now and I'm still a bit pissed by the huge moral clout that those guys carry which I don't think is always justified by their results. But I don't want to ruin anybody's day or treatment approach, as I did often find them helpful in many respects, both drugs and talking.

Damien
Age:29 | Onset Age:24 Correct diagnosis Age: 27.5 | Symptoms: pain, burning in genital region | Helped By: Initial cystoscopy procedure which removed stricture and bladder carcinoma 30% better, less stress, getting better gradually | Worsened By: Feeling out of comfort zone/control, stress.
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Post by Clay »

Around January I started having horrible crushing depression and anxiety every morning. I would improve and by noon be back to 'normal', day after day. I was sent to a psychiatrist, who prescribed a pill. I couldn't handle the side effects. Last month I finally went to a fatigue specialist, who found my thyroid and cortisol marginal and my testosterone very low. I've been on pills and shots for a few weeks, and my mornings have vastly improved.

I would have expected a psychiatrist to at least check out some of the possibilities besides serotonin drugs. There are lots of physical conditions that cause depression, and taking an ssri is just going to put a bandaid on what might be your body trying to tell you something is wrong.

The pain of those hideous mornings, by the way, was easily as bad as the pain from my CPPS.

When was the last time you had your free T3 and free testosterone checked? Don't accept a TSH test, or total testosterone test. Cortisol should be tested by saliva 4 times in a day.
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Age 64, sudden onset 5/06 during bout of flu, colitis, lung and liver problems. Pain in penis, then moved to rectum. No urinary symptoms. Use Lyrica, Elavil, paxil, Xanax, morphine, vicodin, relaxation, pads for sitting, 100+ PT sessions. Sensitive to gluten, milk protein, soy. I have CFS, anxiety, GERD, Barrett's, colitis, kidney stones, one of which referred pain to penis.
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Post by damien6 »

Hello,

Thanks for the post. Look I've never had a testosterone check or been on anything for depression. I would definetly agree that the pain from depression is worse than CPPS, which is why I find it difficult to explain the condition to other people. I have depression because of the chronic prostatitis / chronic pelvic pain syndrome but wouldn't have it without it, so its chronic prostatitis / chronic pelvic pain syndrome which is the condtion and depression which is the problem.

As indicated in the post I have been to many theraputic helpers, none have put me on anything because I usually came across as determined and relatively upbeat and also because initially I was quite anti-drug, especially mind altering drug, but that has subsided. My upbeat state is mixed in with stubborness and really bad crashes so all in all I'm not the easiest person to deal with.

I will probably get my testorone level looked at in the near future, but I'm not sure thats the issue although I'm not a Dr. For me when I'm inactive I feel lousey, exercise and activity etc make me feel well, but they also increase my arrousal/libidio which makes me feel anxious/depressed so I'm generally not very active which causes just depression. Obviously not a virtuous spiral.

I appreciate your post very much and I'll look into it. It seems I may have to go back to the "shrinks" after all which is a bugger. Can I ask what are ssri drugs? Generally my nights are the worst.

Damien
Age:29 | Onset Age:24 Correct diagnosis Age: 27.5 | Symptoms: pain, burning in genital region | Helped By: Initial cystoscopy procedure which removed stricture and bladder carcinoma 30% better, less stress, getting better gradually | Worsened By: Feeling out of comfort zone/control, stress.
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Post by webslave »

damien6 wrote:My upbeat state is mixed in with stubborness and really bad crashes so all in all I'm not the easiest person to deal with.
This sounds a bit like manic depression, which is helped (in a person I know with this) by Lithium. But if you've seen psychiatrists and they haven't diagnosed this.... :-|
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damien6
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Post by damien6 »

Yeah I've evened out a long way. I'm a soldier for Chrissake so I can play it straight when I have to.

Damien
Last edited by damien6 on Fri Jun 29, 2007 11:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
Age:29 | Onset Age:24 Correct diagnosis Age: 27.5 | Symptoms: pain, burning in genital region | Helped By: Initial cystoscopy procedure which removed stricture and bladder carcinoma 30% better, less stress, getting better gradually | Worsened By: Feeling out of comfort zone/control, stress.
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Post by chrisjiujitsu »

I just wanted to point out everyone that I knew in college that majored in psychology was totally crazy and wanted to fix themselves. On top of that they follow a black box style approach to the problem. I think but am not sure it is mentioned in Dr.Wise book that a shrink should be told upfront about the condition (I understand that was impossible for you) or they can do more damage than good proposing ways to fix you.
Age: 26 | Onset Age: 20 | Symptoms: Used to be pain around the base of the penis, now I have golf ball in rectum feeling that can be very painful. | Helped By: kegal exercise/biofeedback (fixed ejaculation pain), antiinflamatory drugs, warm baths (intermediate term relief), hamstring stretching (very short term relief), the biggest being stress management | Worsened By: Stress, Standing for long periods, ejaculating used to make it worse, but not anymore
damien6
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Post by damien6 »

Yeah,

I mean I tried to tell the shrinks that it was a sexual/health problem but they didn't really get it. I was much happier going to the sexual health clinic talking to Dr's then shrinks and have my life picked apart. Sure I have anxiety but its because of this and how it effects your life not other stuff.

Thanks for posting,
Damien
Age:29 | Onset Age:24 Correct diagnosis Age: 27.5 | Symptoms: pain, burning in genital region | Helped By: Initial cystoscopy procedure which removed stricture and bladder carcinoma 30% better, less stress, getting better gradually | Worsened By: Feeling out of comfort zone/control, stress.
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